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<p>Okay!</p>
<p>I talked to Job. It looks like they have no interest in easing
the transition for stragglers who are still announcing AS_SETs in
their AS_PATHs.<br>
</p>
<p>All AS_SETs should result in ASPA_INVALID.</p>
<p>I also just learned the Dutch have a saying... "soft doctors make
wounds stink".</p>
<p>Haha! Thanks again for all your help.</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Ralph Covelli
Network Engineer
Hurricane Electric / AS6939</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/27/2024 4:40 PM, Ralph Covelli
via Bird-users wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:52ef2a71-de80-4329-a61c-234b56e463d7@he.net">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<p>Hi Maria!</p>
<p>Interesting stuff! I suppose you could consider the different
AS's in the SET as "lateral" from each other on "the mountain".</p>
<p>It looks like the newest (aspa-19) wording of the standard
demands that you throw them all out as invalid anyway.<br>
</p>
<p><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sidrops-aspa-verification/"
moz-do-not-send="true">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-sidrops-aspa-verification/</a><br>
<br>
7.2. Algorithm for Upstream Paths<br>
<br>
3. If the AS_PATH has an AS_SET, then the procedure halts
with the<br>
outcome "Invalid".<br>
<br>
7.3. Algorithm for Downstream Paths<br>
<br>
3. If the AS_PATH has an AS_SET, then the procedure halts
with the<br>
outcome "Invalid".<br>
</p>
<p>I am going to see if I can convince the powers that be to
change 7.3.3 to "Unknown".<br>
</p>
<p>Thanks again!<br>
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Ralph Covelli
Network Engineer
Hurricane Electric / AS6939</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/27/2024 12:31 PM, Maria Matejka
via Bird-users wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:Z27kWQdDi4l5t9Lo@livanecnik.jmq.cz">
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<p>Hello Ralph,</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Yes, “I have no providers” is a much more accurate
description of AS 0. It can be used by tier 1 networks as
well as people trying to depreciate their old ASN.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Well, yes, a deprecated ASN has also no providers, yet it can
still be (maliciously) placed into a valid AS path if it is on
the top place. OTOH, with that, the attack surface is limited
only to your downstream networks.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>It looks like the source of my confusion was that I was
under the assumption that the transit ASPA entries could be
used to auto-detect upstream vs downstream as opposed to
doing the check in the filter script. Sorry about that!</p>
</blockquote>
<p>No problem, everybody is confused by ASPA. It’s hard to get
it right.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>I noticed in aspa_check() you check for confeds but
AS_PATH_SET is never checked for.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Well, that looks like another oversight, thank you for
reporting.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>The specs say they should return ASPA_INVALID however I
noticed when I did that I lost about 64 routes which caused
some customer complaints. I had to end up slightly changing
the code to return ASPA_INVALID if upstream and ASPA_UNKNOWN
if downstream.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>Mhmmm. That’s definitely a problem. We can do various things
with and around that. First of all, the default behavior of <code>aspa_check()</code>
must conform to the RFC.</p>
<p>Brainstorming:</p>
<ul>
<li>
<p>something like <code>if bgp_path.contains_sets</code></p>
</li>
<li>
<p>allowing a more precise for-cycle over <code>bgp_path</code>,
e.g.</p>
<pre><code>for bgppath_segment bs in bgp_path do {
case bgppath_segment.type {
AS_PATH_SEQUENCE: for int a in bs do { ... }
AS_PATH_SET: for int a in bs do { ... }
AS_PATH_CONFED_SEQUENCE: ...
}
}</code></pre>
</li>
<li>
<p>adding an optional argument to <code>aspa_check()</code>
to allow sets, treting them as “any of the ASNs in the
set”</p>
</li>
<li>
<p>adding an <code>aspa_is_customer(table, A, B)</code>
function, returning whether A can be a custormer of B
according to the given table</p>
</li>
</ul>
<p>Any other thoughts on that?</p>
<p>Thanks,<br>
Maria</p>
<p>–<br>
Maria Matejka (she/her) | BIRD Team Leader | CZ.NIC, z.s.p.o.</p>
</blockquote>
</blockquote>
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